From the ABC :

Because its stocks are exhausted, the WFP has already stopped providing vegetable oil to 900,000 old people, and as of this week will have to stop delivering essential nutritional supplements to 600,000 children in creches and nursery schools, Mr Banbury said.
If nothing was done by the start of May, 1.2 million child and woman would not receive any more "WFP pulses" and a million other people would be deprived of cereals as of June, he said.

In January, the quantity of rice distributed by the North Korea state to its city dwellers, who account for 70 per cent of the population, was decreased from 300 grams to 250 grams of rice a day, equivalent to just 40 per cent of the internationally recommended minimum.

So much for the vibrant, lively North. And they've just lost their major source of meat - chickens. Again, from the ABC :

North Korea says it has recently culled hundreds of thousands of chickens, as its state media confirmed an outbreak of deadly bird flu in the state for the first time.

Things must be completely out of control if they're reporting it.
It's a race to see whether the poor bastards will die of Famine or Pestilence.

The tortured logic that would somehow excuse the neocrusader Bush governments coddling of Musharef, who pardonned AQ Khan, who sold Nuclear weapons materials and expertize to Iran, NK, Libya, and whoknowswho is another indication of propaganda and disinformation falsely painted as "freedom on the march".


Misfocus your attention on NK pestilence and poverty, and slime the WP and NYT for the stories if you want, - but the grim reality the neocrusaders in the Bush government and all the apologists and sloganeers on theright cannot excuse, ignore, or deny - is that AQ Khans network supplied materials and more alarmingly expertize to some of the worlds most dastardly regimes. A more chilling question relates to who else might have been a beneficiary of Khans proliferatioin activities. One need not be a Rand scholar to imagine other nasty regimes and mass murder gangs acquiring materials and methodologies from the illustrious Mr. Khan. Yet, Pakistan refuses to allow the US access to Khan, nor is Musharef keen of cooperating with the US on Khans illicit activities.


Here again the neocrusaders in the Bush government are placing political expediency above the long -term securtiy of the people of America.

The same kind of duplicitious and retarded policies are responsible for the coddling of America's arch enemies and the neocrusader Bush government "good friends in Saudi Arabia.

The select interests of the neocrusaders in the Bush government continually trump the best interests and the peace and security of the America people.

We will all get what we deserve for allowing the neocrusader Bush government deceptions, failures, and abuses to continue unchecked and for the lack of accountability. Our enemies are "good friends" of the neocrusaders in the Bush government.

Nice bracketing of your entire post with "neocrusader" there, Tony. Got any other new words you hope to make fashionable?

tTony,
Good thing you're so up on Pakistani-US relations that you can state that Pakistan has lent "No" access to Dr. Khan by the US. How do you know this? Do you think this would be publicly announced? When was the last time the "pardoned" Dr. Khan went for a stroll down the street? You have knowlege of this?

Stop making unsubstantiated statements.

Tony, Tony, Tony -- You yap "neocrusader" until one reading your post wants to yack, but then you bitch about "propaganda and disinformation" instead of addressing the issue your label suggests. If you really think the admin. is on a "crusade" (whatever that means), write about that, instead of just sneering the label (again, and again, and again, until -- blaaaaaaht!). Then you bitch because because the admin. is "coddling" Khan, whilst calling out No Ko for making and selling the stufft. Talk about "tortured logic." Khan is the middleman. We should be attacking the source.

I never said the Bush government was coddling AQ Khan, J.


I said the Bush government was coddling Mushareff who pardonned Khan. Either way you dance around the point. The neocrusaders in the Bush government are failing to secure America by refusing to focus on the real threats to our security and prosperity, (Saudi Arabian funding and nurturing, aiding and abetting jihadist mass murder gangs, - Iran and NK WMD threats - Pakistan which is one bullet away for jihadist nukes and incapable of controlling the nether regions of the peshawar where jihadists abound and bin Laden plots the sequel to 9/11 - and all the Gaza mass murder gangs who seek not Palestine, but the destruction of Israel.

Finally, the neocrusaders in the Bush government are insidiously implementing the Pax Americana neverendingwar and emprire agenda and crusade. The neocrusaders in the Bush are radically eroding and shaming democracy here in America, and enforcing a perverted of democracy through a bloody costly noendinsight war and occupation in Iraq.


You and the neocrusaders in the Bush government confuse imperialism with democracy, and tyranny with liberation.

America will rue the day we allowed the neocrusaders in the Bush government to shame, bankrupt, and redefine America.

Foresta, your hypocritical rhetoric is nauseating even me, and I thought I was immune by now. If we strongarmed Iran, Pakistan, or NK, you would be the first one out in front complaining with cries of "empire crusade" or "imperialism" or whatever other little tinfoil monkey agenda made up word of the week you'd invented. So please, PLEASE, spare us your crocodile tears about lack of security here. Its sickening.

Your slime johnnymozart does not alter the facts, nor do you or can you speak for me or attempt to put words in my mouth, or imagine what I am thinking or what I believe in.

Again the point you skirt around is that the Bush governments impotentence in dealing with Iran and NK - who have WMD development programs and are a threat to America's security are monumental failures amplified by the deceptive, predatory, imperialist colonization and costly, bloody wayward occupation and profiteering misadventure in Iraq.

Second, the Bush government "good friends" in Saudi Arabia continue to fund and nurture, aid and abet all the jihadist mass murder gangs. Mushareff's pardonning and shielding of AQ Khan is certainly not improving America's progress on the socalled waronterror.

The neocrusaders in the Bush government pimp pretty patriotic platitudes, and hollow visionary promises, - all of which belie the offal truth that the Bush government failed and decieved America prior to 9/11, before the Iraq war, during the occupation, and the failures and deceptions continue today unchecked and unabated.


America will get what we deserve for allowing the neocrusaders in the Bush government to shame, bankrupt, and redefine America, and profiteer obscenely in and from the process.

So, Tony Foresta, do you or do you not support war with Saudia Arabia, North Korea, or both, to end the threat you claim they pose to the United States?

Would these wars be, or not be, more "deceptive, predatory, imperialist colonization and costly, bloody wayward occupation and profiteering misadventure(s)"?

Simple declarative statements will do.

If you won't say, of course, that in itself will be answer enough.

Rofl. Of course I can you speak for you, Tony and attempt to put words in your mouth, and I can easily imagine what you are thinking and what you believe in. Any reader here with more than a second grade education could. Because you are a hypocrite, and a particularly irrational and garrulous hypocrite, at that. And thus quite predictable, my silly friend. I guarantee that I could post here using your nic and no one, NO ONE would know that it was in fact johnnymozart posting as "Tony Foresta". I hope everyone from now on wonders if its actually me writing your posts.

But you have the opportunity, hypocrite, to prove my slime wrong for everyone to see. To wit, Gabriel Hanna's question: Would you or would you not, Foresta, support military action as a way to reduce the threat that you claim these countries pose to us, the countries, that is, that are currently being "impotently" dealt with?

We the neocrusaders await your propaganda and disinformation with baited breath.

While we're waiting breathlessly for the foreign policy positions you actually advocate--as opposed to simply saying that whatever Bush does is wrong--here is one of the crimes you lay at the feet of Saudi Arabia:

"fund and nurture, aid and abet all the jihadist mass murder gangs....all the Gaza mass murder gangs who seek not Palestine, but the destruction of Israel".

Saddam Hussein, of course, is also guilty of this, his most flagrant example being his $50,000 payment to families of suicide bombers. But you think this behavior is so important that Bush should have been invading Saudi Arabia instead of Saddam's Iraq?

Oh, my mistake! YOU WON'T ACTUALLY ADVOCATE ANYTHING.

Your silence here speaks volumes, Mr Foresta. If you get around to it, do explain what should be done to Saudi Arabia that wasn't done to Iraq. Both regimes were guilty of this, after all. So why should Iraq have been let off the hook for what you say is so awful when Saudi Arabia does it?

But you cannot seriously expect us to believe that in an invasion of SAUDI ARABIA, THE WORLD"S BIGGEST OIL SUPPLIER, that you would not call it "war for oil".

Tony Foresta's Plan For The Conquest of Saudi Arabia

Tony's plan is a confusing farrago, but what he advocates seems to boil down to: commit acts of war against nations that we think are sponsoring terror, such as assassinating people within their borders, freezing their assets in this country, and kidnapping them to the Hague to stand trial, but don't actually go to war with them. Oh, and tell the whole world that the Saudis sponsor terror (like they don't know that already).

In other words, stuff that doesn't work unless pursued on a scale to make it indistinguishable from actual war. The only difference is that the boots on the ground will be entirely those of our enemies.

Tony Foresta wants, essentially, to wave magic wands that will make our enemies disappear without hurting anyone else. Well, it's not so far-fetched to one who already believes that Satan exists and is incarnate as Karl Rove. And of course the motives are commendable. I too would wave those wands if they existed, and I would seek to create them if it could be done.

Unfortunately, I live in the real world.

First you Bush government apologists and sloganeers mangle the question. Is it war, or military action you are asking about? Secondly - no one ever said Saddam did not deserve the noose, but if the neocrusaders in the Bush government went to the American people before the war claiming the justification for colonizing (war and occupation) Iraq, - wasting 225bn of the peoples dollars, 1500+ US soldiers, untold numbers of innocent Iraqi's, strengthening our enemies, and alienating our friends - was because of Saddam's $50,000 payments to the families of suicide bombers - we would not be having this debate. Check your math also, because the Saudi's have and continue to provide hundreds of millions of dollars to jihadist mass murder gangs and render Saddams offerings a trifle.

To the question: No! I do not support war against any nation - unless and until - there is a legitimate threat. Diplomacy first, internationalized political pressure second, - and then if warranted strikes at specific threats. Colonizing soveriegn nations is tyranny, not liberation.

Secondly even if a threat is percieved and legitimate - I reject large scale invasion and occupation scenario's as old world, and impotent startegies against 4th generation warfare adversaries. Striking threats military (preemption) is a longstanding well entrenched policy the Bush government only inherited from every previous American administration. The wild and radical depature the neocrusaders, and neoinquisitors in the Bush government adopted is to shun every and any law, shred the constitution, and embark helter skelter (with no accountability or accounting) on a crusade and profiteering rampage - which is deceptively SOLD as democratizing the middle east. When did responding militarily to the horrors of 9/11 morph into militarily democratizing the middle east.

We all want democracy in the ME. We all want peace on earth and good will toward men. The divides we hold involve the ways and means to achieve these noble and just ends. I believe (and I have the entire history of human evolution as evidence) that military empires are doomed to fail. No nation can impose its will upon another militarily without maintianing a fierce and ruthless military police state.

The neocrusaders in the Bush government are failing to secure America by misfocusing our blood and treasure on the wrong muslims, and actually shielding those other muslims - the jihadist - abundantly aided and abetted, funded and nurtured by the Bush government "good friends" in SA.

Every action America takes now and for decades is exceedingly more complicated because of the bloody costly wayward misadventure in Iraq.

Our options and friends are fewer, and our enemies and threats are greater because the Bush governments failures, deceptions, malfeasance, perfidy, neocrusader ambitions and radical profiteering in Iraq and the nebulous socalled waronterror.

One last point for clarification. I, like every American would certainly support "military action" against any legitimate threat anytime, any where on earth, and most particularly including the Mecca, Medina, Ryhad, Tehran, Pongyang, or Jalabad. But as Gabriel Hanna poinst out - it would be difficult to change the governments or regimes of other nations without boots on ground - and here is our great divide. America has no right to militarily impose any government on any people. America should help in every way to advance democracy all over the world, and provide the foundation and enlightened example of democracy for all the world to aspire to, and assist all nations toward self determination - but war and occupation, colonization, and religious reformation by military means is doomed to fail. Militarily imposing governments on soveriegn nations is tyranny not liberation. The Bush governments hegemony, predatory lawlessness, and "imperial hubris" are financially and politically unsustainable, militarily impossible, and morally repugnant.

The neocrusaders and neoinquisitors in the Bush government are morphing America into the former Soviet Union with a brutal cabal of rightwingideologues usurping total control of the government, suppressing and silencing debate, and cloaking the malfeasance and perfidy under the shadows of the flag.

LOL. Accusations of "sloganeering". Heh. That's rich coming from you, Tony. Gosh, well, let's see......"

Posted by johnnymozart:

///you would be the first one out in front complaining with cries of "empire crusade" or "imperialism" or whatever other little tinfoil monkey agenda made up word of the week you'd invented. ///

Posted by Tony Foresta

///To the question: No! I do not support war against any nation - unless and until - there is a legitimate threat. ///

.///...aiding and abetting jihadist mass murder gangs, - Iran and NK WMD THREATS///

..but, of course, you don't support military action/war/whatever, you support "limited strikes" on a country with 6500 pieces of artillery within visual range of Seoul. And when that invariably fails and "strengthens our enemies", you would be the first one to blame Bush and complain about imperial hubris or jingoism or whatever word floated your boat that day. One doesn't need the visual skills of an Emmy winning cinematographer to see the hypocrisy in that.

Once again: ///Secondly even if a threat is percieved and legitimate - I reject large scale invasion and occupation scenario's as old world, and impotent startegies against 4th generation warfare adversaries. ///

So let's get this straight: War/invasion is always wrong. If diplomacy fails, international pressure, if international pressure fails, then limited strikes at specific threats. But if limited strikes fail, its because Bush is a neocrusader, malfeasant, or an imperialist, or because he did it all wrong.

Again, no rational suggestions, just vague fanciful and unrealistic platitudes....and of course, the obligatory rabid criticism.

So, despite my being a slimy neoinquisitor, I was right after all.

Hypocrite.

The funny thing about your criticism johnnymozart is that the proposals I present exactly mirror the Bush government's current policies toward Iran, NK, and Syria. The only reason Iraq was colonized, is because - as Wolfy said - the neocrusaders in the Bush government could - and no one could stop them. There are no more cold war type threats wherein large armies clash for lands and goods. Rather - our more disturbing adversaries are purely ideological and stateless. NK is no threat to America - even with nukes. Nor is Iran a direct threat to America with nukes. Nor is Syria any direct threat to America. Of course Iraq was certainly no threat to America either - regardless of the information warfare conducted on the American people asserting these false and deceptive claims. These governments - whacky as they may be - comprehend that any action involving WMD against America or American interests would result in Pongyang, Damascus, or Tehran or Bagdhad being reduced to glass.


What will and can the neocrusaders in the Bush government or any future America administration do if a stateless mass murder gang like al Quaida, or Hamas, or Hezbollah, or Jamaa Islamiya, or any of the jihadist mass murder gangs succeed in detonating a dirty bomb in a stadium, or loosing some martyr infected with a chimera bug into an airport or subway station? Who will we attack? Where? How? Invasion and occupation strategies are impotent against this kind of adversary. Our enemies are born and nurtured in wahabi backed and funded jihadist madrasses. Jihadists are our enemies, and Jihadist islam is the enemy of every none jihadist on earth. Jihadists are primarily funded and nurtured, aided and abetted by elements of the Bush government "good friends" in the House of Saud. Ignoring, excusing, cloaking, and refusing to recognize and act on this FACT BASE REALITY - is a recipe for disaster that compromizes the security of American now and forever.


The neoinquisitors and neocrusaders in the Bush government are now - after the costly bloody noendinsight misadventure in Iraq - adopting the very proposals I outlined above - although there is no percieved legitimate threat as of today, so there are no military strikes at specific threats. None of this happened before Iraq. The neocrusaders in the Bush government deceptively SOLD the Iraq war, colonization, and radical profiteering misadventure to the American people by conducting information warfare on the American people and terrorizing the entire world into believinig war, colonizaiton, and radical profiteering was necessary to prevent "days of horror like none we have ever known", "mushroom clouds" and all the other fiery and patently FALSE assertions the neocrusaders promoted prior to the war.

America is alone in Iraq. America alone must hazard and endure the enormous and bloody costs of this wayward misadventure. Theright pretends Iraq is some great accomplishment often making wildly inaccurate comparisons with WWII. This comparison is as laughable as it is deceptive. Iraq was never a threat to America. There was no WMD, and no al Quaida links. Iraq was no threat. So why are we there for this long? Why have we wasted 225bn of the people's dollars and 1542 US soldiers for a war we did not need to fight? Where is our money? Where is the accounting? Why are we still loosing a soldier a day to insurgents? When will we leave.

Now theright, and the sloganeers and apologists for the neocrusaders in the Bush government - including the complicit parrots in the mainstream media continue bruting the visionary hopes, and the hollow promises of what may someday happen, or what might someday bring an end to this nightmare - but the costly bloody realities of today cannot be washed away with ficitons and myths.

The world would have seen the same ends in Iraq much sooner, with far less bloodshed, and far less cost to the American tax payer had the neocrusaders in the Bush government adopted then, the policies they are forced to apply now - and I touch upon above toward NK, Iran, and Syria.

Saudi Arabia on the other hand is a direct threat to America in two manifold way. OIL & WAHABISM! SA control of 40% of the worlds oil is a noose around America's neck. Wahabi backed and nurtured Jihadist all over the world want to slaughter Jews, American's and all infidels, and no money, no land, no political solution will assuage thier perverted ideological ambitions.

Until SA is openly addressed, and wahabism isolated and discredited as the primitive, perverted, tyrannical, mass murdering disease that it is - the haunting specter of 9/11 two will always hand like a dark cloud over America.

Whatever, Tony. Let's review. I made the comment that you would be the first to complain if the Bush neocabal attacked one of these "threats" you are so hypocritically worried about; which of course, you would. You basically responded that that's NOT what you would do, and that I didn't know what I was talking about.

So what do you say when Gabriel Hanna asks you what you WOULD do?

YOU SAY THE EXACT DAMN THING THING I PREDICTED YOU WOULD, AND THEN TRY TO CLAIM THAT THAT ISN'T WHAT YOU ARE SAYING. I SAY AGAIN, YOU ARE A HYPOCRITE, SIR.

So go "wave your Dongs" in front of somebody else, HYPOCRITE.

Oh, and by the way, do you think no one noticed that you failed to address one iota my previous points? Do you think people didn't notice that you simply lapsed back into the Iraq=wrong, Bush=bad reflex regurgitation without explaining how what you said amounts to "not being the first one to critisize the Bush admnistration" when it is in fact EXACTLY that? They wouldn't even be worth reading if they weren't so amusing.

Your increasingly lengthy and silly doubletalk diatribes serve only to further prove my point and embarrass yourself. That you are indeed a hypocrite is right here; obvious for all to observe. Feel free to have the last word.

One last thing. It is amazing to me that you have the stultifyingly breathtaking stupidity to follow the sentence containing the phrase "a nuclear Iran or NK are no threat to us" with the theoretical questions "What if a mass murder gang like Al Qaeda detonated a dirty bomb? Who would we attack?"

Sigh. Exactly, Tony. That's the fucking point. Always has been.

The scary thing is you're actually serious. Later, you silly troll.

Ok, class, time for definition of terms. “Sliming” is defined as any time a conservative points out that a liberal is lying through his teeth.

Tony Foresta would like us to believe that he would not complain if Bush acted militarily instead of, in his words, “ignoring NK and Iranian WMD threats” These are his words. Of course, three posts down he points out, quite explicitly, that he doesn’t believe that a nuclear Iran or NK are a threat to America. Well, which is it?

And so we are apparently to believe, despite this obvious inconsistency, that Tony Foresta would not, upon awareness of a limited strike on one of these threats, immediately sit down at his keyboard and furiously make up words to fully describe the ignominy of the action of George W. Bush against one of these “threats”. Neodictator, perhaps, Tony?

So, let’s summarize: First, Bush is ignoring NK and Iranian WMD threats, unless of course he actually does something, and then he’s a malfeasant maledictor who is only trying to enrich Halliburton. That’s of course, if he uses full scale invasion, which Tony doesn’t agree with; No, Tony believes in “limited strikes” on “”specific threats”. Of course, Tony doesn’t specify what he thinks should be ACTUALLY DONE if “limited strikes” fail, just that full scale war won’t work and that Bush is a big meanie. I’m sure that’s because Tony doesn’t know either, or perhaps he thinks we should go back to numbers 1 and 2 on the list: “diplomacy” and “international pressure”. I know Tony, ACTUAL THOUGHT is so much harder than simply stringing non-related words and phrases together. But, for the sake of argument, lets say Bush uses limited strikes, that’s ok, according to Tony, unless they don’t work and Pyongyang flattens Seoul, in which case, Bush is an oligarch neocrusader. In the EXTREMELY unlikely event that they DO work, of course, then why, they were “never a threat to begin with, and why are you “ignoring” the mass murder gangs of Al Qaeda, you oligarchical, mindwarped slimemongers” etc etc etc etc.

By the same token, if we strongarm Saudi Arabia, we’re a neocabal interested only in a war for oil because they are “no threat to America”. If we don’t, then of course we’re “ignoring” Saudi Arabia’s jihadist perfidy. Great. So if we do something, that’s wrong, and if we don’t do something, that’s wrong, too.

Definition #2: Liberal- a state of being where you can never be wrong, even when you are.

All. Bullshit. I will concede, however, Tony, that perhaps I was wrong. Perhaps this isn’t hypocrisy, after all. Perhaps its stupidity. Or dishonesty. Or both.

And you guys wonder why the American public won’t trust you with their security? Ha. You can’t even remain internally consistent in your own posts in ONE THREAD. I go to bed each night a happy man that the most impact Tony Foresta and his ilk can have on current US foreign policy is pounding on their keyboards in impotent rage. Puts a big radiant smile on my face every time I think of it.

So you guys stick to criticizing Bush’s iPod selections, and leave the big decisions to the grown-ups. You're better off that way.

Class dismissed. Johnnymozart OUT.

Easy johnnymozart, you'll make yourself sick with all that slime oozing out of your mouth.

You are correct however that I did mistate the threats that a nuclear armed NK or Iran would pose to America. I concede this was inaccurate, and confusing and distorted the orginal message, that NK and Iran, like Iraq before the war, pose no direct threat to America now.

To clarify: Iran and NK nuclear development programs are indeed a threat to America.

The neocrusader Bush government policies toward Iran and NK are impotent and flawed neither curbing nuke development, nor acting in any meaningful way toward diplomatic solutions.

The neocrusaders in the Bush government have absolutely ZERO credibility or legitimacy with the rest of the world, regardless of the information warfare mantra's to the contrary bruted by the neocrusader disinformation and propaganda covens.

Saudi Arabia is a mortal enemy of America, and "good friends" of the neocrusaders in the Bush government.

This conflicted and duplicitous relationship has already and will again some day soon grieviously injure America. Saudi abundant nurturing and funding, aiding and abetting of jihadist mass murder gangs will

The neocrusaders in the Bush government are failing to secure America by wasting blood, treasure, credibility, and prestige colonizing the wrong muslims in Iraq.

I personally do believe the neocrusaders in the Bush government are warmongers and profiteers, and each a "malfeasant maledictor who is only trying to enrich Halliburton", or Dyncorp, or Lockhead Martin, or ESS, or SAIC, or Exxon, Enron, United Defense, CusterBattles, Blackwater Resources, Wachenhut, et al. or any one of the many thousand of private military companies enriched by and beholden to neocrusader warmongers and profiteers in the Bush government.

American's must demand accountability with regard to the revolving door incestuousness and obscene profiteering ongoing through the neocrusader Bush governments nefarious Pax Americana neverendingwar and empire ambitions.


Your slime aside, - you talk about what may happen someday and pretend you can imagine what I would or would not do. You are projecting out into some unknown uknown unforeseen future that does not exist.

From my position, your rage is indicative of the fact that we liberals are proven time and time again to be correct, and only after the fact do you righties morph to about face in policy into something of your own.

Ponder these facts before you sleep.

Iraq today is niether free, nor liberated, nor are Iraqi's "better off" than before the neocrusader Bush governments costly bloody wayward misadventure in Iraq.

The America people have no accounting for the neocrusader Bush governments expenditures in Iraq and beyond. We know the totals, (maybe), but the details and the specifics are missing, and all we know is that America is hurling more than a billion dollars a week at Iraq, and there is still NOENDINSIGHT!!!!

Jihadist threats, abundantly funded and nurtured, aided and abetted by the Bush government's "good friends" in SA continue working diligently on the WMD sequel to 9/11.

There is as of this date not one piece of WMD any discovered, and niether has any single piece of WMD of any kind been rendered harmless or destroyed, or dismantled under the neocrusaders in the Bush government.

So, here's the rub. Now and well into the future each and every, and any foriegn policy decision America makes will be tainted and complicated by the costly bloody wayward misadventure in Iraq.

Until America brings the SA funding and nurturing, aiding and abetting of jihadist mass murder gangs into the light of day and forces (diplomatically, politically first, and then if necessary militarily) an end to these unholy machinations - the terrible threat of the WMD sequel to 9/11 remains a quesiton of when, not if.

The neocrusaders in the Bush government have been forced by events in the field to alter, morph, change, reverse, and in many ways cloak specified and unspecified policies, that are exactly the kinds of policies we on theleft argued for before the war.

- Internationalized cooperation toward the global goal of defeating jihadist mass murder gangs,

- diplomacy and political remedies first, the terrible swift sword as a truly last resort or in the face of immediate credible threats,

- some standard or code of conduct that abides by our guiding principles and does not allow for a neocrusader cabal of rightwingideologue warmongers and profiteers to ingore or stand above or beyond the law.

- accountability from our leadership, and an honest transparent assessment of the real costs in blood and treasure, and the timeframes involved in US warmaking adventure.

Every office and individual in the US government, including all the Executive brank, the offices of State, and the Pentagon were thoroughly DEFEATED on 9/11 by 19 jihadists (15 of them SA's) with box cutters.

Every office and individual in the US government, including all the Executive brank, the offices of State, and the Pentagon were thoroughly DEFEATED again during the run-up to the war, (wherein all the intelligence used to justify the war was 'dead wrong" and the subsequent bloody costly (with no accounting) colonization misadventure in Iraq (wherein all the intelligence provided by the same single sourced uncorroborated, unvetted, OSP pimped individual) proved catostophically wrong.

There is no democracy in the ME.

Jihadist threats are greater not fewer.

The neocrusaders in the Bush government are conducting information warfare on the American people and shapeshifting monumental failure into visionary hopes of success.

Class open for questions.

And Tony, sentences should end with a period. Run on sentences are difficult to read, show tenuous logic, and are typical of lib****ls.

LOL. (big radiant smile) Careful Tony, All those lies and stupidity coming out of your mouth are liable to make the rest of us sick. See also definition of "sliming" above.

Your 12-inch long non-answer, non-refutation of anything I said that can't be bothered to be burdened by paragraph separation is simply further proof that neither you nor your party have anything constructive to suggest. You confirm BY YOUR OWN WORDS that what I have said is absolutely ture. You simply wish to have the luxury of saying that anything Bush does is wrong without having to actually be Accountable!! for suggesting anything that might work. I say again, hypocrite, that actual thought is oh so much harder than simple autistic-style hiding behind slogan repetition. You simply repeat the same tired rhetoric over and over like a magic chant, in the face of all logic, evidence, and common sense, as if its the first time all of us have heard it, instead of having refuted it, like, oh, a million times. But I guess, even when your ideas fail, you say they don't fail, it was all Bush and the warmongers fault. Right, Tony?

Which is why neither you or party is trusted by the American people to manage anything more complex than a lemonade stand. Have a good time in fantasy land. Hope those fingers don't get too tired, because you're going to be using them a lot the next 4 years. :)

Excellent post, Tony Foresta the irritating slimemongers and soulless minions of orthodoxy will never see through their truebelieving hagiography of Saint George to see that we, the liberalintelligentsia are right in protecting innocent Iraqis from the terribleobtrusion of neverendingwar, that is to say thewarthatneverends. This bloody, wayward, silly, expensive, malfeasant, mercurial, offensive, illegal, ideological and non-accountable and did I mention illegal and malfeasant war is purely the product of neverending warforoil. You correctly point out that timeandtimeagain we liberals are proven correct with our neverending contradictory positions. Thak goodness that there are those of us who can see through the conservative mindwarp of the Bush/RoveHalliburton cabal that is stealing our souls and the livelihoods of allinnocentAmericans and Iraqis. We should continue to empower dictators and massmurderers of all kinds because to do otherwise would risk us appearing as the neocrusaders we are. The accountability provided by a free election in the US is laughableindeed. The Americanmindwarped truebelievers and rightwingideologues do not understand, because they are drownign in the vomitous bile and slime of the warmongers. So if they do not understand, we will MAKE them understand. The revolvingdoor incestuousness of the neocabal that is the conservative party must end and we must have accountability for the good of the commonwealth. All dissent will be destroyed. Resistance is futile. Long live the People's Revolutionary Struggle from neverendingwarwithnoendinsight!!

If Paul Wolfowitz ate NEOpolitain Ice Cream, would Tony's head explode?

Tony Do you know what colonize means?

Seems like TCP must enjoy the hit meter level that comes with being Foresta'd...

True Cap'n,

Tony keeps this up, CP will have as many comments as Redneck Texan.

Well close anyway.

Man, thems some lame ass attempts at getting yourselves banned here. Trouble is yall are beating around the bush. You need to be more direct if you want to see some results.

If y'all are really wondering why Alan & Michele no longer seem to be willing to enforce their comment policy, all you need to do is have a look at THE RESULTS of their purging these threads of lively commenting.

Respectability amongst their journalistic peers has come at a steep price.

Of course if you really want to drive the wedge home, you should point out that at least Michele had the good sense not to enact Type-key registration at her personal blog. Which I think speaks volumes as to who really killed the CP as a vibrant gathering place to discuss the day's news.

The CP has gone from the top 10 at technorati blog rankings down to 94 and is still dropping like a rock since the management administered all the fun out of coming here. But please don't rub it Alan's face, I am sure he feels bad enough about it already.

And trust me, whatever you do don't mention dancing on their graves, that will get you banned everytime.

I apologize for the grammatical and syntactic errors in my posts. Since my internet access is intermittant, there is no time to edit.

Thelefts solutions are clearly conveyed. Internationalized cooperation and commitment in the dismantling and destruction of jihadist mass murder gangs and those who aid and abet them.

Accountability from our leadership, with particular emphasis on accounting specifics relating to the bloody costly wayward misadventure in Iraq and the socalled waronterror.

The demand that our leadership abide by our own laws and those international laws relating to warfighting, occupation, propaganda, and profiteering.

From our perspective, the neocrusader Bush government's many failures, deceptions, malfeasance and perfidy, dereliction of duty, rape of the constitiion, bruting of partisan propaganda and disinformation through perception management and information warfare, complete lack of accountability, brutish imperialist hubris, predatory rightwingideologue ambitions, and wild and obscene profiteering from the costly bloody wayward misadventure in Iraq and beyond - contribute to the increase of security threats to America. Since and because of these issues, the neocrusader Bush government has retarded America's legtimacy and credibility through-out the world - every foriegn policy decision or choice confronting America (NK and Iranian WMD development particularly) is more complicated. America has more enemies and fewer options and allies as a direct result of the neocrusader Bush governments pernicious policies, lack of accountability, and wild and obscene profiteering.

Lol. Gosh, it neoseems that Tony's neoprotege has neocaused neohim to neodisplay some neopersonal neoinsight. It is even neofurther neoamusing that he neoblames his neoridiculous neoparanoid neodiatribes as a "lack of editing" while still neoavoiding the neoQUESTION that was neoASKED; instead choosing to neoavoid, neoobfuscate, and continue to neomake neocontradictory neostatements

Perhaps you should neospend more neotime neorefining your neohonesty, instead of on your neoparanoid neodelusions, you neohypocrite.

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