I can't believe that anyone with any intelligence is surprised about these continual attacks against American soldiers. Personally, I am convinced that GWB was forced, from a political standpoint, into declaring the conflict in Iraq at an end way back when.

The US needs to take decisive action and temporarily but severely implement restrictions and penalties for those who are still "at war" with the US. The average Joe here in the US is only going to put up with this shit for so long. We would prefer George and Don re-open a 55 g allon drum of whupass! Get the job done... then worry about rebuilding what's worth rebuilding.

Tom,
I sympathise with your feelings. BUT We went in to this war holding the moral high ground (I'm sure Antony and PTG may not agree, but you can't please some people any of the time).

Along with the moral high ground goes the Rule of Law. Our boys and girls have put, are putting and will continue to put their knecks on the line, to hold on to the moral high ground and to maintain the Rule of Law. Much as we would love to open your proverbial drum of Whupass, (and why bother with a 55 Gallon drum, serious industrial strength Whup can be delivered in 10,000 litre tankers);
we are the guys in the white hats, wouldn't do the job if I didn't believe that that was true.

The days of bombing villages and calling in the fast jobs, because you'ld been ambushed outside a village are long gone.

Also , military experience shows that injudiciously applied violence tends to turn the innocent civilian population against you. Even in the Sunni heartland where this a genuine and probably reasonable fear of life after Saddam, the majority of people just want to get on with their lives, earn a dinar or two, smoke and chat with their friends, raise families and live in peace. we recently took 6 dead, ressisted the temptation to "Whupass" and now its all been tidied up.

Still I understand and share your frustrations, thats why we have disciplined soldiers.

I want to make one historical fact absolutely clear. The President did NOT say "the war is over". He said, "Major combat operations are over." There is a HUGE difference. "Major" combat ops imply an enemy organized at least at division strength.

The "war" is a war on terrorism and its backers. Iraq is one battle. The "war" won't be over on GWB's watch, or his successor's. The real question is whether his successors will have the gonads to continue the fight.

MG

The point is, the US Forces already have lost the battle for the hearts and minds of the Iraqi People.
They are seen as what they are, occupying Forces.

Why do you think Mr Rumsfeld call such desperate for german and france Troops? Simply because they have a better reputation in the World than US Troops if it comes to non interference with local interests, the respect for local culture and the People.
And of course because Mr Rumsfeld is a coward, he know for sure this steady losses undemine his position in the US Administration. He's to blame for that bad planning, so he will have to go if Mr Bush need to sacrify a pawn to keep his power. No wonder he seeks desperatly new troops to mop up that mess he had created.

The answer from Germany and France was clear,
not without firm UN involevent.

http://www.dw-world.de/english/0,3367,4789_W_917045,00.html

Hand it all over to UN then leave Iraq, the US Forces in Iraq are already the largest obstacle in the Peace process in Iraq.

you'd like that wouldn't you, Nobody. Let the USA do all the hard work, then let the cowards have the oil?
Talk about day dreaming

Besides, what forces do the UN have?
NONE

Yeah, Nobody;

Imagine the dog and pony show France and Germany would bring to Iraq, LOL.
The entire involvement of Chirac and his ass boy Schroder, left to their own devices, would be to try to sew up a profitable enterprise for France and Germany. Then the REAL "Quagmire" would begin.
I can see it now, Saddam back on the throne in a few weeks, "business as usual", and then the lives of all the Coalition troops who died in the name of freedom would have been sacrificed for nothing.
Nobody, you and people who think like you are as big a threat to the rest of the world as any ten Husseins.

Sooner or later the American people are going to demand more that just phrases like "bring it on" or other well crafted nuances. The soldiers there are tired and getting desperate, as recent reports suggest. If guys like Bubba or Seth really care about what happens to our troops and Iraqi people, I a very curious what are their constructive ideas to solving the problems, other than screw everbody else. With that attitude we are just going to keep screwing ourselves. We are there and have to deal with it. Most of the guys still there were sent to fight a ground war not for peacekeeping. At some point the mothers are going to wonder why are there boys still out there getting shot at, and why aren't they going to get more help.

Nobody! I'm not goin' to repeat myself, you dolt. Go here: http://www.command-post.org/archives/007929.html

That oughta keep you busy for awhile...

OBTW, Nobody - I'm kinda tired of findin' you sploogin' on threads which reference my dead brothers. THEN you want to practice the fine art of drive-by sploogin' on top of it. You are a definite candidate for the toxic waste site...

May these fellow brothers not have died in vain.

DB

Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, our troops are still over in Iraq for a highly valid reason. What they are there to accomplish will ultimately save your children and grandchildren from a threat that, once it is allowed to go too far, will be a lot less possible to stop, if possible at all.
We may lose a few hundred lives now, and I don't take even one of them lightly, my heart and thanks go out to each of them and their families, but in so doing, tens of thousands, or more, innocent lives will be spared.
If we simply "Frenched" it and pulled out now, Iraq would go right back to the way it was under Saddam and all those deaths you speak of will have been, as I said, for nothing.

dB, have you ever been in the Army? have you even seen Action?
I have.
Don't bother trying to tell me what those boys are thinking.
You are there to do a job, and despite what your pea sized brain thinks, that job includes peace keeping.

Oh hell, I'm not going to bother bein' polite.
DB!
If you're goin' to make comments like that, at least show some sympathy for the family of those that this post recognizes! Shoot your can of Slim-fast, and be done with it. You can make that kind of a comment on any other thread on this board, but don't splooge on these, you dolt.

Let the UN handle it???

You gotta be kidding. Kofi Annan has asked GWB to send American troops into Liberia which I interpret as his acknowleding that the UN can't handle it.

Incidently, I am adamantly opposed to ANY US troops going into any African nation. We have our pocketbook committed and our hands full now.

Some of the more modern African countries' leaders have volunteered to deal with the problems on their own continent, and Bush seems agreeable. I hope this includes Liberia.
Have you noticed that ol' Kofi, who's usually opposed to the U.S. doing anything without first grovelling for UN permission, suddenly wants us to go into Liberia?
That, right there, ought to make us suspicious. Maybe there's something really dirty and "quagmiring" going on there and he'd rather see us involved than his French and German pets.

liberia isn't a place I would want to take my last tour, certainly not without us/brit elements. I've been hemming and hawing whether or not to go do one more before i pull the plug. looks like Afghnistan is my only option at this point, plus I've never been there.